Color management tweaks

I do a lot of note coloring. I'd love to see the following capabilities:

• A persistent color management toolbar/palette, perhaps detachable from Inspector, for one-click color control of objects (in fact, I'd like various quick-access palettes, as with Adobe UI design; the Inspector is good, but I'd like to reduce the number of clicks required)
• When displaying/setting colors via the Inspector, the color displayed in the boxes should be set automatically to match the color of the current selection (as with Microsoft Office UI design). Frequently I want to change (for example) a red symbol to a half-red, half-blue symbol. It would reduce keystrokes if the color were set to the current value, rather than leaving it at my last setting.
• I'd like more ways to split colors. At the least, add "top/bottom" to "left/right" and preferably let me set all four quadrants independently.
• Instead of today's pop-up color chooser, provide a persistent color palette (either within a larger-format inspector or in an independent window/toolbar) linked to the current selection, for one-click color reading/setting/copying/etc. (To be clear: this feature is orthogonal to the color management palette suggested above. This feature corresponds to the pop-up color chooser; the above feature corresponds to the part of the Inspector that deals with note coloring.)
• Provide links to 'recently used' colors as shortcuts in the color chooser.
• Provide a way to "add color" to a note, rather than just setting it. This would either a) set an "uncolored" note to a give color, or b) split the note's current color into two or more quadrants and add the specified color.
• Provide tools for automatic selection/coloring by range (i.e. over groups of strings or frets or note types or fingerings), preferably aware of the idea of "adding color" to a selection (above). For example, I just did a diagram where I colored chord blocks on adjacent strings/frets, alternating colors to show blocks built off the 7th string versus 6th string versus 5th string etc. in each section of the fretboard. I would have liked to say "add red to these four strings, these four frets" and magically see the new color overlaid on the specified notes.

I hope these suggestions are clear, and seen as helpful. Perhaps some of these are in the works already. Thanks for a great tool.

Is there a plugin framework exposed for users? I am just starting to use your tool, so I'm not sure how broad the feature set might be. I don't see any sign of user-extensible features, but the log makes it clear you have a lot of horsepower in the engine. That might be a way to address some advanced capabilities. - Trevor

Lots of points here Trevor! I'll maybe respond with a post-per point or I'll be typing a while and will get nervous a wrong keystroke will send me back a page and I'll lose all the typing!

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A persistent color management toolbar/palette, perhaps detachable from Inspector, for one-click color control of objects (in fact, I'd like various quick-access palettes, as with Adobe UI design; the Inspector is good, but I'd like to reduce the number of clicks required)

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This is something I can consider for 2.0 I guess :) Personally though I'm not so keen on the multi-window Adobe approach, although that might just be because I use a big monitor and having all those tool windows over the other edge of the screen can be a bit of a pain!

Definitely something worth considering although any major UI changes might warrant a 'focus group' of users so there's no unpopular choices pushed on users..? (c.f. like what happened with Apple's unpopular Final Cut X changes)

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When displaying/setting colors via the Inspector, the color displayed in the boxes should be set automatically to match the color of the current selection (as with Microsoft Office UI design). Frequently I want to change (for example) a red symbol to a half-red, half-blue symbol. It would reduce keystrokes if the color were set to the current value, rather than leaving it at my last setting.

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Hmm I would say it already does what you suggest, possibly just an issue of wording semantics here!
The Inspector shows the current settings for the selected object(s), so I guess if you've selected a note and changed the colour settings then select another note then it'll look like the settings reverted but they're actually showing the settings for the currently selected item - if it were to show the colours as you say then those would be for the previous object, not the current one which would be confusing!

What I think you're asking for is a way to re-apply the previous change to another object? Maybe the MS-toolbar approach works well for toolbar shortcut type things, however remember the Inspector is a way of observing & editing properties of items. I'll have to think of a way how this could be added, but it would probably need to be separate to the Inspector. Strikes me as similar to 'Redo'.. perhaps for maximum flexibility another option under the Edit menu, like 'Apply last change to current selection'

Just had a thought - spreadsheets such as Excel usually have a 'Copy Special..' type of command allowing you to copy/paste styles between cells. Maybe this is the kind of thing that's needed? :confused:

BTW are you aware you can select multiple items and set their properties together in one fell swoop?!

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I'd like more ways to split colors. At the least, add "top/bottom" to "left/right" and preferably let me set all four quadrants independently

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Sure, why not! Won't the diagram end up a bit "information overload" like that though?

I'll raise a ticket for this, hopefully will come up with a flexible way of controlling this - a dialog window rather than adding stacks more option rows :o

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Instead of today's pop-up color chooser, provide a persistent color palette (either within a larger-format inspector or in an independent window/toolbar) linked to the current selection, for one-click color reading/setting/copying/etc. (To be clear: this feature is orthogonal to the color management palette suggested above. This feature corresponds to the pop-up color chooser; the above feature corresponds to the part of the Inspector that deals with note coloring.)

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If i've understood correctly, you want to be able to persist your colour choices, e.g. to create your own palette of commonly used colours?

The operating system already handles this via the 'Custom colours' palette on Windows, and on Macs via the palette strip in the bottom section of the colour chooser. You can drag your colours into the palette for later reuse. :)

There is however a bug on Windows in that the custom palette isn't persisted across sessions - exit ND and the custom palette isn't remembered unfortunately. This is something the underlying platform I use will have a fix for in their next major update so I should have this incorporated in a release in the 2nd half of the year. (Works fine on Macs though)

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Provide links to 'recently used' colors as shortcuts in the color chooser.

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I suppose this would be handy if you forget to add a colour to the custom colour palette (although fairly easy to go back and add it).

The colour chooser is a system provided dialog window however, and I'm not sure there are hooks to add custom content in there, at least not from the API exposed to me.. :(

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Originally Posted by Justin

Lots of points here Trevor! I'll maybe respond with a post-per point

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BTW no need to post extensive replies, unless you think discussion is needed. I have been using these posts as a way to get my usage notes down in writing and visible to you. Use, modify, or ignore as you see fit.

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Originally Posted by Justin

Personally though I'm not so keen on the multi-window Adobe approach, although that might just be because I use a big monitor and having all those tool windows over the other edge of the screen can be a bit of a pain! Definitely something worth considering although any major UI changes might warrant a 'focus group' of users

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Let me make a couple of points here. 1. I think anything that causes a radical CHANGE to UI should be done cautiously, unless it's an obvious improvement in functionality. However ADDITIONAL UI features (such as an optional 'colors' toolbar or palette) should cause less heartburn. People don't have to use them. 2. The strength of the Adobe-style tool windows is that, for people doing extensive repetitive editing, they can eliminate dozens of mouse actions per operation. Thus I drag my little palette-of-interest over to where I'm working, do my 50 operations or whatever it is, then send it back to its home. As long as right-click brings up the most intuitive operations in a given context, and as long as the Inspector provides access to EVERY feature that is a) logical to find there and b) modifiable by some other mechanism (you don't want some features accessible via Inspector but others only via different menu options) then the "Law of Least Astonishment" is obeyed.

Hope that's helpful.

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Originally Posted by Justin

Hmm I would say it already does what you suggest

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Sorry, didn't make this clear enough. It's the 'left/right' colors that should be filled in to match the current color. That way, I can split the current color in half, rather than having to set both sides manually. In the example below, I probably want to leave the note red but add a second color.

Attachment 19

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Originally Posted by Justin

What I think you're asking for is a way to re-apply the previous change to another object?

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Always a handy feature, like the Microsoft F4 functionality.

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Originally Posted by Justin

spreadsheets such as Excel usually have a 'Copy Special..' type of command allowing you to copy/paste styles between cells. Maybe this is the kind of thing that's needed?

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Another highly useful feature, same as 'select special'. I often want to select or paste with respect only to certain features.

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Originally Posted by Justin

BTW are you aware you can select multiple items and set their properties together in one fell swoop?!

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Yup. Do it a lot.

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Originally Posted by Justin

Sure, why not! Won't the diagram end up a bit "information overload" like that though?

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Powerful features are always at the risk of being abused/misused, but that doesn't make them bad. The place where I'd appreciate four color quadrants is where I'm DOCUMENTING something interesting, as opposed to creating a practice/study aid. So a particular note might participate in four adjacent chord or arpeggio shapes that I want to tie together in a single diagram. It's a capability that should be used infrequently, but when needed it would exactly fit the bill. Also, one could use left/right coloring versus top/bottom to indicate something else -- just two colors per note, but colored in different orientations. Again, these are graphic subtleties that will sometimes be desirable. There's a tradeoff between simplicity and power, but a tool like this is always going to have a lot of power users.

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Originally Posted by Justin

I'll raise a ticket for this, hopefully will come up with a flexible way of controlling this - a dialog window rather than adding stacks more option rows :o

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I'll always vote against adding dialogue windows on actions that might be used repetitively, because this adds a LOT more mouse operations. Think about how superior a set of alignment buttons is to a series of drop-down combo boxes.

You already have a number of symbol shape buttons on the left toolbar (diamond, triangle, etc.) that logically seem they should be echoed in the Inspector (i.e. I should be able to pick the shape of a note the same way I can pick its color). In other words, these are orthogonal properties: a symbol's external shape (square, circle), its internal shape (unbroken, left/right, top/bottom, four quadrants), presence of outlining, the color of each internal element, etc.

The toolbar on the left is good for drawing and changing symbols; why not also use it to DISPLAY and SET these object properties? Instead of four hollow and four solid shapes, you could have buttons for a) the four shapes, b) hollow/filled, c) left/right division, d) top/down division, e) outline, etc. These would automatically turn on and off, reflecting the state of what was selected; or they could be used to create or change shapes by drag/drop. This would seem very intuitive to me, pretty much the way modern WYSIWYG graphic editors operate. Of course quite a big UI change, so I realize this isn't a trivial suggestion.

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Originally Posted by Justin

If i've understood correctly, you want to be able to persist your colour choices, e.g. to create your own palette of commonly used colours?

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No, sorry, I wasn't clear. I'd like a color chooser that stays around, like the toolbar buttons on the left and the inspector, where I can select a color with a single click. This process: 1. Select note. 2. Click 'red'. Done. Today, I need to click the color picker button on the inspector, and then choose a color in the pop-up, and the click OK. Three clicks versus one, and a lot of mouse movement away from the note in focus.

This is distinct from the desire for access to recently-used colors, as seen in this MSWord UI element:
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I realize that you are dependent on the dialogues/APIs exposed by your platform. On the other hand, since I don't know exactly what these are, I might as well ask for my dream UI and be told "it's too hard" than not ask at all. :)

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Originally Posted by Justin

I suppose this would be handy if you forget to add a colour to the custom colour palette (although fairly easy to go back and add it). The colour chooser is a system provided dialog window however, and I'm not sure there are hooks to add custom content in there, at least not from the API exposed to me.. :(

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Understood (see above). The issue here isn't so much that I want to add custom colors. Rather, when I'm creating a diagram with just a few colors (the normal case), I will constantly setting most of the objects to just those colors. However this requires some precision pointing to be sure I grab the correct red or green or blue or whatever. I will often notice later on that I accidentally hit the adjacent color entry on one object. The MS Office UI element with 'recently used colors' showing at the bottom of the chooser (and even more: the default operation if you click the 'set color' button rather than the down-arrow that brings up the chooser) is a real convenience that I use constantly. It avoids the need for a precise mouse operation so I can work more quickly.

But again, if you're using an inherited color picker this is basically moot. Either they'd have to add this feature to the platform, or you'd have to decide this was important enough to build your own (unlikely until you have a team of a hundred engineers working on this tool, heh heh).

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Originally Posted by spinality

It's the 'left/right' colors that should be filled in to match the current color.

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I just realized that you could simplify the note color portion of the inspector by getting rid of the 'override color' button entirely, and just having the 'left' and 'right' color choosers -- PLUS a 'link' or 'lock' button between them that, when selected, makes the right the same as the left (analogous to 'maintain aspect ratio' link buttons common with height/width settings). Then, when you click on any note, the two color buttons would immediately be set to the current color of the left and right parts (which would often be the same, and would often be the default color).

This would save me a lot of time (today, when changing a single-color note to two colors, we have to set both left and right, since the choosers don't inherit the default or the override color).

If you add top/bottom colors, as discussed earlier, there would be a natural UI extension with some more 'link' buttons to tie any pair of adjacent colors, or to tie all four colors.

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This is probably more discussion than you wanted on this trivial point but I just spent half an hour coloring the left and right sides of a LOT of notes. :)

UPDATE: Oh, just noticed that setting an override color for a root note does NOT override the root color if root coloring is turned on. Logically, I think a user would expect that an override would...erm...override.